Several noob questions.

Hello Dear Friends.

There is no doubt that this is one of the coolest projects for txs. Since the first time I heard about Deviation firmware, I thought “at last, someone is building something functional that makes sense”. It was only a matter of time to own a DEVO, so I recently purchased a DEVO 10 black, and I am very happy with it. Although it was somehow a steep learning curve for me from DX6i, I did manage with a lot of reading to setup all my DSM2/DSMX models to my new DEVO 10, and they all fly very well.

But, no matter how much I tried to understand things, there are a few questions that I couldn’t find an answer for, or the answer was not very clear for me to understand. I was hoping that someone would know the answers, or some of them, and be kind to reply.

1. Range Test. I read numerous threads about this, but no clear answer. The tx its self doesn’t have a test function, but does have the ability to alter the output power. So I did a test with the tx set to 300uw. I got 24 meters before I lost connection. Is this good or bad? Does this qualify as a “pass” or “fail”? If I only got lets say 15 meters, would that be considered “pass” or “fail”? What is the lowest range limit for that given power output to be considered a “pass”? Is there a formula to calculate to what range these 24 meters correspondences to a full 150mw power output?

2. I also have a WLtoys V911-1 with its tx, and a WLtoys V222 with its tx too… That makes me a happy owner of a A7105 module and a NRF24L01 module. I would love me make the DEVO 10 able to fly all my WLtoys models. Is it possible to install both those modules inside the tx, aside the already existing one in the tx?

If so, do I have to modify the hardware.ini file everytime I want to change the active module? Say I am flying my 450 FBL heli, with DSM2 protocol, and then I want to fly the V222, do I have to connect the tx to the pc and change the .ini file accordingly, or I can just select my model and the tx will choose the correct module to use? I know I need to activate the modules in the ini file, but do I have to deactivate all the ones that are not in use?

3. I have seen an hour video were a guy demonstrates how to build a universal module. The process is far beyond my capabilities, no question. Forgive me if this is not an appropriate question, but is that module available somewhere commercially? Or does someone build it and sell it? Is there somewhere I can purchase it readymade with instructions on how to solder it in a DEVO 10 black? Does anyone provide “module” making services? It is very hard for me to send the tx to anyone, but maybe I could purchase a readymade module that just needs to be soldered as a “whole” inside the tx. Or even better plugged somehow outside the tx?????

4. By reading several different threads in this forum and in other forums, I got the impression that the Deviation firmware is no longer developing anymore, and instead there is another firmware called “Nightly”. Is this correct? I am running Deviation 4.1 now. Is it enough for what I want to do or do I need to install Nightly? (That is install something like the Universal Module, or at least install the A7105 and the NRF24L01 modules).

Thank you for your time.

Hi,
Let me try to answer some of your questions, although I am not a developer or electronics engineer
1.)
You could read this thread.
devo-12s-dsmx-range-and-telemetry-questions
If you want to contribute your results please try do describe your test setup.
Be aware, range depends greatly on environment conditions.
e.g. humidity, level above ground, vegetation, obstacles, orientation of antenna.
Formula:
range at 100mW (=max legal in many countries) =~ 30x range at 100uW

6db difference ~= double range

-10 dbm	= 100 uW
-5 dbm	~= 300 uW
0 dbm	= 1 mW
+5 dbm	~= 3 mW
+10 dbm	= 10 mW
+15 dbm	~= 30 mW
+20 dbm	= 100 mW
+22 dbm	~= 150 mW

2.)
It is possible to install both those modules. It may be safer to buy new ones instead of scavenge from your existing TX (leaving existing TX as a backup and for testing).
Yes, you can just select model and the tx will choose the correct module.
user manual
Module Installation

3.)
AFAIK not commercially available.
Maybe in the far far future this single-board-universal-module may become available.
It would "plug and play" into Devo10, Devo8, Devo12 (just replaces the existing Walkera module)

4.)
"Nightly" is the current development build of Deviation. New features, but less tested than "stable" 4.01.
Generally expected to work, but as with all new things there remains some risk.
Once considered ready for "public use" there will be a new release.
preparing-for-the-next-deviation-release

4.01 is the current "stable" release.
AFAIK 2 extra modules should be possible with 4.01.
Universal module would need newer versions aka Nightly.

Thank you very much for the so detailed and clear answers. They helped me a lot.
I read the other thread with the DEVO12s, there is so much info in there too, but it is somehow complicated to find a reason, or a solution. I am mostly interested in the facts because that is all i got as an end user with no special knowlege.

So, following your suggestions i did some range tests today. Sunny afternoon, temperature 23 Celsius, Humidity 40%. All the helis and planes tested were on a plastic table. The hight is 50cm.

I used my previous tx a DX6i DSMX capable (and DSM2 of course) with US power settings. And my new DEVO 10 black, with the latest 4.01 Deviation firmware.
I checked with a variety of different receivers, from my mcpxs and 130xs, to Orange and Lemon Rxs.

1) Lets start with the 130Xs. I was much surpised to find out that both only had 2 to 4 meters range when bound to my DEVO 10. They are bound with DSMX protocol. At 300uW the range was no more than 4 meters. At 100 uW one of them would only be bound as far as one meter away. On contrary, when bound to the DX6i, i got 11m meters on both of them which is not good either to be honest. I redid the test with the DX6i, and i found that over 11 meters the 130Xs would temporarelly loose connection, but quickly regain it. In any case the DX6i performed much better. I raised the power output of my DEVO from 30 to 100 mW for my 130X, just to feel more confident. It is true i didn't have any signal lose till now, but 130Xs didn't fly too far away either. Maybe there is something esle going wrong with these 130Xs, and i would defenatley discart the results. All other tests gave much different results. Only ONE thing to remember from this test here: DSMX !!!!

2) I tested my mcpx. With the DX6i i got 60 meters and could even be more if i had more way. With the DEVO at 100uW i also got 60 meters and could go a bit more. Please note that my DEVO is bound with DSM2 to my mcpx. It won't bind with DSMX, i don't know why. Anyway, maybe it's much better with DSM2. Besides i think the difference between DSM2/DSMX is mainly "cosmetic" since i am not flying in a crowded with models area anyway.

3) Next, my Easystar with Orange DSM2 R620 receiver with R100 satellite. DX6i got 60 meters and DEVO 10 with 100uW power also reached 60 meters. I wish i had more space. It looks very satisfactory althought I don't know how DEVO's 100uW compare to DX6is range check output power.

4) ICON A5 with Orange DSM2 R710 with no satellite attached to it. DEVO 10 made it to 45 meters with 100uW power.
5) Lemon DSM2 6 channel receiver. DEVO 10 made it to 35 meters at 100uW. This is mounted on an small Grasshopper which flyes closely to me because i can't see it far out anyway.
6) Lemon DSMX 6 channel receiver + Lemon DSMX Satellite on my carbon quad, bound as DSM2 and NOT DSMX made it to 45 meters on 100uW power. It didn't pass my mind that moment to bind it as DSMX and redo the test. I did that a few hours later. The humidity was 15% higher and temperature was 15 celsius. The result was 23 meters for 100uW power. That is half the range i got with just binding it as DSM2.

I am sorry i didn't perform the test for those receivers on the DX6i too, but it was difficult to rebind them where they are put.

Also note that both my mcpxs are bound as DSM2 because DSMX binding always fails. One of them is V1 and the other is V2, so it doesn't have to do with the version of mcpx. Probably others can bind them as DSMX without problems. I don't want to lead to a confusion here, i just report the fact.

To me there is a clear range advandage of DSM2 over DSMX, unless someone has reasons to think otherways. Or maybe there is something wrong with the DSMX protocol.

What do you think of the results? Is lets say a range of 35 or 45 meters considered to be a "pass" at 100uW, or not?

Spektrums advice on range test is to walk to ~30 yards, and verify that you have control while in range test mode. IIUC, they have drop of 30db for their range test, which is what you get by going form 100mW to 100uW. That 30dB drop represents a factor of 30 drop in range, so if you can get to 35 or 45 meters at 100uW, you should be good for most of a kilometer at 100mW. So I'd say yeah, 35 or 45 meters at 100uW passed fine.

Also, Spektrum recommended that those with DSM2 Tx's only need to upgrade if they were flying at large events. The rest of us would be fine with DSM2, so you should be fine with DSM2 as well. I certainly have no qualms about using DSM2 instead of DSMX. I'm not sure how crowded urban 2.4GHz environments compare to a large RC event, but I don't fly in those either.

The integrated Rx boards used in the smaller aircraft (by which I mean things up to the first 350QX, and maybe the second one as well) go wonky when presented with more than 7 channels by deviaitonTx. If you really want to bind with them in DSMX mode, try setting your tx to only as many channels as the Rx actually has. I'm not positive that that will make a difference, but it might.

Thank you all for your advice and information. I am now so much more confident with my DEVO 10. I have now placed an order for the A7105 and NRF24L01 to transform this uniq transmitter to the multimachine it realy is.