Standard Mixer Take-2

PhracturedBlue
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18 Feb 2013 19:41 #6522 by PhracturedBlue

Standard Mixer Take-2 was created by PhracturedBlue

Ok, I think the rest of the system is stabilizing nicely, so I'm going to go back and finalize decisions on the Standard mixer.

We had a thread about this a month ago (see here):
www.deviationtx.com/forum/6-general-disc...223-simplified-mixer

But it ended badly, so I've decided to try again here.

This is NOT a discussion about whether or not we should have 2 GUIs. Do not bring it up.

Keep it civil in here. I'm happy to listen to anyone's opinion, but attacking or belittling other members of this forum for any reason is not acceptable.

This is your best opportunity to impact the standard GUI display. Feel free to comment on either the Devo8 or Devo10.

Points from the previous discussion:

* I've decided to keep the 9-point curve for this release. perhaps we'll support 7, 11, and 13 point curves in the future, but not this release

* The GUI will now no longer display setting for a 3rd position if a 2-pos switch is used

* The GUI will show the currently assigned switch for a page on the header (320x240 only)

* The standard gui is only supported for Helis today. If you use a plane, the GUI will switch to Advanced mode

Some of the other points were already addressed by suvsuv. If you have remaining issues that you think should be addressed before release, please post them here.

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FDR
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18 Feb 2013 20:12 #6524 by FDR

Replied by FDR on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

Is the reason of no standard gui for airplanes, that it uses CCPM?
You could disable/hide the swash options (while setting it to 1 servo) and it woud work for planes...

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PhracturedBlue
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18 Feb 2013 20:20 #6525 by PhracturedBlue

Replied by PhracturedBlue on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

The GUI has settings like 'Pitch' and 'Gyro' which make no sense for Planes. I don't think it is a lot of work to make it compatible, but I'd rather not expose functionality that is not complete.

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PhracturedBlue
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18 Feb 2013 20:21 #6526 by PhracturedBlue

Replied by PhracturedBlue on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

I also just committed a change to make the Pitch/Throttle graphs fully automatic which seems more intuitive to me.

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FDR
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18 Feb 2013 20:28 #6527 by FDR

Replied by FDR on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

PhracturedBlue wrote: The GUI has settings like 'Pitch' and 'Gyro' which make no sense for Planes. I don't think it is a lot of work to make it compatible, but I'd rather not expose functionality that is not complete.

Actually planes can have gyro too.
Somebody call this cheating, but they are more and more common I think...

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FDR
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18 Feb 2013 20:29 #6528 by FDR

Replied by FDR on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

PhracturedBlue wrote: I also just committed a change to make the Pitch/Throttle graphs fully automatic which seems more intuitive to me.

Cool!
I cant keep up pulling and compiling!

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FDR
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18 Feb 2013 20:47 #6529 by FDR

Replied by FDR on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

Not only a standard ui issue:

Since the timer page is one column again, there should be more space for the labels (especially for some translated texts).

The timer groups could be a little more separated.

The labels are not properly redrawn when they are changing (the old labels leave some residue).

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rbe2012
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So much to do, so little time...

18 Feb 2013 21:08 #6530 by rbe2012

Replied by rbe2012 on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

Tested devo8-8f97c19
Model menu: we have 16 icons. Should we arrange them 4x4? Or use the free space to display them in groups?
For the swash page: it would be nice and helpful to have an explanatory text or picture.
Also there: "ELE Mix" "Ail Mix" "Pit Mix": ELE should be Ele, I would like more longer text (no abbreviations)
Gyro sense: here is the different range obvious (and different to advanced gui). Should we notice it ("Range: 0 to 100%")?
Pitch curves: should be mentioned which switch is defined for throttle hold if used?
Switch assignment: there are again abbrevs.
BUG: Timer setting: try to set a switch for timer1 (countdown, ch3, 3:00) shows "00:00" in the switch field and asks for resetting.
BUG: Timer Setting: try to set a swich for timer2 (stopwatch, ch3) only ch3 selectable or none. Also for timer3
I don't like that when you changed standard to advanced or back you find yourself first in the old page structure. I think it would be better to switch back to main page, then to the new model menu, then to config page (maybe invisible for user).
Changing from standard to advanced: the gyro setting are not transferred. I did not examine too far but I think there maybe some old setting become visible. I think every value which is not transferred correctly (should never happen) should be set to an initial value. I will look into this tomorrow.

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domcars0
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18 Feb 2013 21:31 - 18 Feb 2013 21:36 #6532 by domcars0

Replied by domcars0 on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

rbe2012 wrote: Tested devo8-8f97c19
BUG: Timer setting: try to set a switch for timer1 (countdown, ch3, 3:00) shows "00:00" in the switch field and asks for resetting.
BUG: Timer Setting: try to set a swich for timer2 (stopwatch, ch3) only ch3 selectable or none. Also for timer3

Hi rbe2012,
I'm unable to reproduce this bugs in the emu_devo8? Are you in standard or advanced mixer mode ?

Devo 10 (+7e) owner. It's mine, please don't touch it with your big fingers

Last edit: 18 Feb 2013 21:36 by domcars0.

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quique65
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18 Feb 2013 21:40 #6533 by quique65

Replied by quique65 on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

Hello,
please, can you implement the last Standard version from sunvsuv that includes a Program Mix page?. Thank you.

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FDR
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18 Feb 2013 21:42 #6534 by FDR

Replied by FDR on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

rbe2012 wrote: BUG: Timer setting: try to set a switch for timer1 (countdown, ch3, 3:00) shows "00:00" in the switch field and asks for resetting.

Actually I think it is a feature: the permanent timer shows it's current value on the reset button...

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domcars0
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18 Feb 2013 22:07 - 18 Feb 2013 22:22 #6535 by domcars0

Replied by domcars0 on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

Hi FDR I've made some redesign for the Devo6/8/12 timers setup page.
Also the label refresh must be good now.

Also 4 timers will be available. I think permanent timers are usefull for lot of things!

@rbe2012: normally you see the Reset field, with time in the button for resetting, when you choose permanent timer, not when you choose countdown nor stopwatch.

Devo 10 (+7e) owner. It's mine, please don't touch it with your big fingers

Last edit: 18 Feb 2013 22:22 by domcars0.

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PhracturedBlue
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18 Feb 2013 22:48 #6537 by PhracturedBlue

Replied by PhracturedBlue on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

rbe2012 wrote: Tested devo8-8f97c19
Model menu: we have 16 icons. Should we arrange them 4x4? Or use the free space to display them in groups?

There will likely be 17 soon.

For the swash page: it would be nice and helpful to have an explanatory text or picture.

There is plenty of room. If someone wants to come up with a picture for each mode, I'll add the code to draw it. I don't like using text here though, so will probably not go for the description solution.

Also there: "ELE Mix" "Ail Mix" "Pit Mix": ELE should be Ele, I would like more longer text (no abbreviations)

I capitalized 'Pit' for consistency. I could fit full words, but I'd rather keep the strings aligned between Devo8 and 10, So I'm going to keep the abbreviations.

Gyro sense: here is the different range obvious (and different to advanced gui). Should we notice it ("Range: 0 to 100%")?

Done

Pitch curves: should be mentioned which switch is defined for throttle hold if used?

Yes, I'll fix this.

Switch assignment: there are again abbrevs.

same as above

I don't like that when you changed standard to advanced or back you find yourself first in the old page structure. I think it would be better to switch back to main page, then to the new model menu, then to config page (maybe invisible for user).

Definitely a bug. I'll fix this too.

Changing from standard to advanced: the gyro setting are not transferred. I did not examine too far but I think there maybe some old setting become visible. I think every value which is not transferred correctly (should never happen) should be set to an initial value. I will look into this tomorrow.

The Standard GUI is implemented using the Advanced-GUI mixers, so there shouldn't be any case where going from Standard->Advanced changes functionality. The configuration may be non-intuitive though. I'm open to trying to implement the Standard-GUI mixers in a more obvious way if folks can point out specific inconsistencies.

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PhracturedBlue
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18 Feb 2013 22:51 - 18 Feb 2013 22:52 #6538 by PhracturedBlue

Replied by PhracturedBlue on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

Domcars, The timers work in an unexpected way when in the standard mixer, but work fine in Advanced mode. I ahven't looked into it yet though.

Last edit: 18 Feb 2013 22:52 by PhracturedBlue.

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PhracturedBlue
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18 Feb 2013 23:03 - 18 Feb 2013 23:03 #6540 by PhracturedBlue

Replied by PhracturedBlue on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

quique65 wrote: Hello,
please, can you implement the last Standard version from sunvsuv that includes a Program Mix page?. Thank you.

Only if someone can tell me how it works.
When i setup a AIL->Aux2 mixer, it shows AUX2: 40 when AIL=0. I think I understand this as roughly equivalent to adding an extra 'simple' or 'exp/DR' mapping, but I don't understand how it works.
Also, once you've setup a program mixer, apparently you can't change the source without deleting/recreating it?
To me it doesn't look like this capability is complete, and I don't want to add new functionality at this point unless it is fully baked. If I'm just misunderstanding how it works, please enlighten me.

Last edit: 18 Feb 2013 23:03 by PhracturedBlue.

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domcars0
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18 Feb 2013 23:04 - 18 Feb 2013 23:07 #6541 by domcars0

Replied by domcars0 on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

As I'm unable to switch the emu in Standard mode on my Ubuntu at home (always my "*** stack smashing detected ***: ./emu_devo8.elf terminated") , I will try to take a look tomorrow at work..
Is this issue on both screens (Devo10 and Devo8)?

Devo 10 (+7e) owner. It's mine, please don't touch it with your big fingers

Last edit: 18 Feb 2013 23:07 by domcars0.

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PhracturedBlue
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18 Feb 2013 23:11 #6542 by PhracturedBlue

Replied by PhracturedBlue on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

Yeah, it is on both. My guess is that it is something suvsuv changed, and is not related to your changes. I just don't know yet.

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domcars0
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18 Feb 2013 23:35 - 18 Feb 2013 23:36 #6543 by domcars0

Replied by domcars0 on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

I don't understand why but it looks like when in standard mixer mode timers src
are restricted to the throttle channel (Ch3 or Ch1)?... I do not understand why sunvsuv made this restriction ?

Devo 10 (+7e) owner. It's mine, please don't touch it with your big fingers

Last edit: 18 Feb 2013 23:36 by domcars0.

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PhracturedBlue
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18 Feb 2013 23:57 #6544 by PhracturedBlue

Replied by PhracturedBlue on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

He probably made it because this is generally what people use. I mean, how often do you base your timer on aileron motion?
Maybe it would make more sense to limit it to throttle output + switches though. The point is to make the interface intuitively obvious, and offering options that make no sense go against that principle. So while we could remove the restriction altogether, it is likely the wrong thing to do for the Standard mixer.

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vlad_vy
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19 Feb 2013 04:25 #6551 by vlad_vy

Replied by vlad_vy on topic Standard Mixer Take-2

PB, can you change 5-GEAR1 to 5-GEAR? Pages: Reverse, Subtrim, Travel adjust, Fail safe.

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