Devo 12s 3in1 / 4in1 RF module neat installation.

HappyHarry
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08 Jun 2016 21:52 - 08 Jun 2016 22:13 #50213 by HappyHarry

Replied by HappyHarry on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

thanks for the info, iirc i have a cx-11 and a cx-10 wifi, and a flureon fx-10 somewhere, i think one of those uses the cx-10 blue protocol, what kind of distance would i need to try and bind from to check this out?

[edit]
ok I found my fx-10 and it does indeed bind using the cx-10 blue-a protocol, and managed to bind from ~7m away (2 farthest points in my house with a direct line of sight), is that sufficient to show the nrf issues are resolved?

also turns out it has a faulty motor, I really should have tried to fly it long before now lol
[/edit]

Last edit: 08 Jun 2016 22:13 by HappyHarry.

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BirdBarber
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08 Jun 2016 23:44 - 09 Jun 2016 00:19 #50216 by BirdBarber

Replied by BirdBarber on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

PhracturedBlue wrote: Why are you concerned with power? is battery life on the 7e really an issue? The answer is that a 4-in-1 with the 7e removed should use the least power.....

I was concerned about the voltage regulator overheating. It seems like some people can get away using the stock VReg if they use NiMH batteries, and some can't. So minimizing power requirements might be helpful.

I thought I would give it a try with stock VReg and NiMH and if it didn't work then I would add a switching regulator and convert to LiFe. It would be really nice if somebody made a switching regulator with a built in LiFe charging circuit.

Last edit: 09 Jun 2016 00:19 by BirdBarber.

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wasp09
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09 Jun 2016 00:19 - 09 Jun 2016 00:32 #50220 by wasp09

Replied by wasp09 on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

BirdBarber wrote: I was concerned about the voltage regulator overheating. It seems like some people can get away using the stock VReg if they use NiMH batteries, and some can't.

I thought I would give it a try with stock VReg and NiMH and if it didn't work then I would add a switching regulator and convert to LiFe. It would be really nice if somebody made a switching regulator with a built in LiFe charging circuit.

It wasn't about overheating for me. The little LDO on my 7e just saturated and cut off with my extra RF modules running certain protocols, e.g. KN. My guess it is a 150mA LDO. I added a 0.8-1A LDO to supply the RF modules and leave the stock LDO to supply the MCU alone.

You get 10 for $1:

www.ebay.ca/itm/10X-AMS1117-3-3-3-3V-1A-...2:g:7R8AAOSwLVZV7VyA

or 20 for $1.14:

www.ebay.ca/itm/20x-AMS1117-3-3-V-0-8A-P...e:g:d34AAOSw2GlXIFYC

Add as many as you like if you worry about overheating.

Normally we don't expect any big current, e.g. RFX2401C is 350mA max, and we won't transmit non-stop.

Last edit: 09 Jun 2016 00:32 by wasp09.

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PhracturedBlue
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09 Jun 2016 00:34 - 09 Jun 2016 00:35 #50221 by PhracturedBlue

Replied by PhracturedBlue on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

if you are worried about the Tx LDO than the 4-in-1 boards (with a proper daughter board) will be better since they have an independent LDO. If you roll your own, you are responsible for that, but I would really want an independent supply for these boards, as their performance can be impacted y having a non-stable power source.

Note that using a high voltage battery is still a bad idea, since the LDO dissipates heat proportional to the input voltage, which is just wasted power.

Last edit: 09 Jun 2016 00:35 by PhracturedBlue.

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wasp09
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09 Jun 2016 01:36 - 09 Jun 2016 01:39 #50223 by wasp09

Replied by wasp09 on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

I don't really have a 4 in 1. If you are connecting to the 3.3V of the 7e. It is a bad idea since the current I could take off from the 3.3V rail is very limited.

The original RF module isn't fed from the 3.3V rail. If the 4 in 1 follows the original RF module, it must have a LDO onboard. That is a different story, probably OK and won't require another one in series.

Yes, using a higher voltage is a bad idea as many devices on the 7e can't really go above 4V.

Last edit: 09 Jun 2016 01:39 by wasp09.

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PhracturedBlue
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09 Jun 2016 02:33 - 09 Jun 2016 02:34 #50224 by PhracturedBlue

Replied by PhracturedBlue on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

the 4-in-1 module itself does not have an LDO. It is supplied by 3.3V. Howver, you can't hook a 4-in-1 directly to a Deviation Tx easily, you need a daughter baord. We have 2 options now: 1) cmPang's board which I believe requires soldering of the extra control lines, and victzh's which is plug-and-play (note that neither is readily available at this time). Both, I believe, have an onboard LDO.and can be driven by 5V.

Last edit: 09 Jun 2016 02:34 by PhracturedBlue.

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BirdBarber
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09 Jun 2016 03:54 - 09 Jun 2016 04:30 #50227 by BirdBarber

Replied by BirdBarber on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

I didn't think a LiFe would be a problem if I used a switching voltage regulator. It shouldn't be wasting power when dropping the voltage like a linear regulator. I thought RF noise might be the only issue. I was thinking of dropping the LiFe voltage using a switching regulator set to 4.8V or less output, and running that to the 7e LDO and the 4-in-1 via separate lines. Wouldn't that work ok? What would be the best output voltage to use, I've never worked with LDOs, just with 7805 and such.

Also, if I used NiMH, could I just run raw power straight from the battery to the 4-in-1 daughter board since it has an LDO? Maybe I missed that option.

Last edit: 09 Jun 2016 04:30 by BirdBarber.

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PhracturedBlue
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09 Jun 2016 04:29 #50232 by PhracturedBlue

Replied by PhracturedBlue on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

An LDO is just a standard VReg with a low Minimum Vin-Vout. It really isn't any different than the 7805. I used a switching regulator on the UniversalTx board. Sweet little part and it allows you to run pretty high voltages with very little loss. While we never got to the point of validating te performance, in theory the TPS62172 we designed with would have had no effect on the RF performance. The main issue with using any type of pre-regulator on the main input the the Tx is you'll lose the ability to monitor battery voltage (which can be very bad for you battery depending on the chemistry)/. I recommend using a 2nd LDO (or a good switching reugulator like the one I just mentioned) for the RF chips regardless of the solution, and using a battery that is less than ~6V as the input for the 7e. Anything over that and you aren't getting much value, and are stressing the existing voltage regulators. Of course, it may be possible to replace the LDO on the 7e with a switching supply. I've not seen one that is pin compatible, but if you did that, you could use any battery you like.

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BirdBarber
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09 Jun 2016 04:34 #50233 by BirdBarber

Replied by BirdBarber on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

Thanks, that really clears things up. I never thought about the battery monitoring.

Sorry for all the questions, but as a casual user it's hard to figure this stuff out without any spec sheets. It would be nice if there was a chart of voltage and current required for the x-in-1 modules, multi-module, individual modules and also for the various transmitter raw power requirements.

And also thanks to you and all the other developers that make my favorite transmitter possible!

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Evil Pusher
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D.I.Y. or die

10 Jun 2016 14:27 #50329 by Evil Pusher

Replied by Evil Pusher on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

HELP HELP HELP

For my DEVO 6 i bought the 3 in 1 module at BANGGOOD

The connections are:

GND -> GND
VCC -> Vout on an extra DC/DC stepdown
SCK -> SCK
CS 2401 -> TCK
CS7105 -> TMS
CS2500 -> not connected

CS2500 not connected - is this okay?
Or does it have to be grounded or is there an option to solder it to any pin (µC)? Looking on the pinout for DEVO 6 Hardware connections - i guess, there is no option....

Here the tx.ini and hardware.ini.

If anbody have an solution - Thank you now.

D.I.Y. or die

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benoit35
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10 Jun 2016 15:01 #50333 by benoit35

Replied by benoit35 on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

Hello,
same question for me with a Devo 8S : where to connect the wire ?
Thanks

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mwm
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10 Jun 2016 20:30 #50351 by mwm

Replied by mwm on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

For the 6, if you take out the RF module there's a line of three through holes that aren't connected to anything obvious. The middle one is ground, and the other two are C9 and C10. You can use one of those. IIRC, the left-hand one is C10, but I'm not sure.

IIUC, the 8 requires soldering to an mcu pin. If you search the forums, you'll find a list of pins which can be used for that.

Do not ask me questions via PM. Ask in the forums, where I'll answer if I can.

My remotely piloted vehicle ("drone") is a yacht.

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Fernandez
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10 Jun 2016 20:51 - 10 Jun 2016 20:53 #50355 by Fernandez

Replied by Fernandez on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

wasp09 wrote:
BirdBarber wrote: I was concerned about the voltage regulator overheating. It seems like some people can get away using the stock VReg if they use NiMH batteries, and some can't.

I thought I would give it a try with stock VReg and NiMH and if it didn't work then I would add a switching regulator and convert to LiFe. It would be really nice if somebody made a switching regulator with a built in LiFe charging circuit.

It wasn't about overheating for me. The little LDO on my 7e just saturated and cut off with my extra RF modules running certain protocols, e.g. KN. My guess it is a 150mA LDO. I added a 0.8-1A LDO to supply the RF modules and leave the stock LDO to supply the MCU alone.

You get 10 for $1:

www.ebay.ca/itm/10X-AMS1117-3-3-3-3V-1A-...2:g:7R8AAOSwLVZV7VyA

or 20 for $1.14:

www.ebay.ca/itm/20x-AMS1117-3-3-V-0-8A-P...e:g:d34AAOSw2GlXIFYC

Add as many as you like if you worry about overheating.

Normally we don't expect any big current, e.g. RFX2401C is 350mA max, and we won't transmit non-stop.

I would not recommend AMS1117, as 4.8V NiMh, nominal. Empty pack alarm normally would be 4.2V, the dropout is pretty high. I used Ams before and it resulted in a suddenly full stop of my Tx......According sheet Vin should not go below 4.5V

This one is really really good for battery powered devices, very tiny pcb and already has good decoupling and filtering caps around. High efficiency. www.pololu.com/product/2122

I have some ideas but no time to look into it;

I would like to install 2 parallel, 18650 (yes it fits that I tested, very few mods to the holder, and still can alos go back to batteries)
www.banggood.com/NCR-18650-3400mAH-3_7-V...nasonic-p-72906.html
And install a tiny lion charger circuit at the Volt in of USB port.

Last edit: 10 Jun 2016 20:53 by Fernandez.

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HappyHarry
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10 Jun 2016 22:21 #50363 by HappyHarry

Replied by HappyHarry on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

i was actually looking at using the kentli li-ion cells, these are a AA sized li-ion cell that has it's own vreg in each cell to drop the voltage to 1.5v, doing this they have managed to get 2800mah into a AA that's just over half the weight of a ni-mh cell, and they get charged with the usual 4.2V CC/CV li charge method. they are expensive though, and i'm not sure how the low voltage circuit kicks in as they will always manage to give 1.5v right down till they are empty so it would be risky in a transmitter if they just suddenly cut off

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BirdBarber
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11 Jun 2016 05:55 #50381 by BirdBarber

Replied by BirdBarber on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

Fernandez wrote: ...This one is really really good for battery powered devices, very tiny pcb and already has good decoupling and filtering caps around. High efficiency. www.pololu.com/product/2122 ...

Looks good, safer and longer battery life.

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derFrickler
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11 Jun 2016 11:44 #50394 by derFrickler

Replied by derFrickler on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

Hi There. Just installed the 3in1 Module i got from Banggood some time into my Devo 7e.

All sub-Module seem to work with Deviation 5.0, only FrSky D8 protocol won't bind. As the FrSky V8 protocol is working, i guess the CC2500 Module in general is OK.
I had a separate CC2500 module in the Devo 7e beforen which worked fine with the same Deviation 5.0.

An Hints? I read something about the LNA enable PA enable on the early modules, but i am not shure if i am affected.

Thanks
Johannes

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Toadman667
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11 Jun 2016 15:54 #50405 by Toadman667

Replied by Toadman667 on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

Considering the difficulties with these modules, what's the best components to use for upgrading a Devo 7e transmitter today? Are the modules at banggood fully working and fixed, and what can we do in lieu of any available daughterboards right now?

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HappyHarry
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11 Jun 2016 18:57 #50411 by HappyHarry

Replied by HappyHarry on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

derFrickler if you look into the options for the frsky protocol there are fine tuning options, I'm not sure if that's the issue but it's something to try

toadman777 i'd wait for the new deviation version 4in1 to be released, either that or victzh's daughterboard. as the newest 4in1 boards (13 pins on the left side instead of 12) have all of the issues fixed

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brother_maynard
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11 Jun 2016 23:02 #50437 by brother_maynard

Replied by brother_maynard on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

Just wanted to confirm that I was connecting the 3-in-1 module correctly to my Devo 7e. With appreciation to all that provided the source graphics for my humble image hack here I just wanted to verify this was being done correctly thanks!

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HappyHarry
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12 Jun 2016 08:03 #50457 by HappyHarry

Replied by HappyHarry on topic 3in1 / 4in1 RF module

yeah looks good to me bud

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Devo 12s 3in1 / 4in1 RF module neat installation.

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